Shaw: The question about older boats being structurally stronger than some of the contemporary boats using modern materials and construction techniques is sort of a double edged sword. In the early days of fiberglass construction it was true that we did not know as much about the material and the loads imposed upon it as perhaps we do today. Consequently, in many areas the boats were over built, but there were also examples of boats that were under built during that same period. The question about older boats being structurally stronger than some of the contemporary boats using modern materials and construction techniques is sort of a double edged sword. In the early days of fiberglass construction it was true that we did not know as much about the material and the loads imposed upon it as perhaps we do today. Consequently, in many areas the boats were over built, but there were also examples of boats that were under built during that same period.

Pearson expended a lot of time and effort in trying to analyze the structural properties of fiberglass laminates. We ran thousands of tests and developed scantlings from which the various boats were built and therefore, we knew, I think, about as much as anybody as to what was needed. However, with the contemporary materials and construction techniques and with the computer programs that are now available to the industry for structural analysis, we know a lot more about these loads and therefore can design to them.

There is no secret that, as long as you know what the loads are, the solution of the problem becomes rather academic. So I would say that overall, the boats today are as strong as they need to be. If there is a problem, it may relate to some of the newer materials that have more recently come to the marketplace in which there is not a great deal of knowledge. The use of carbon fibers, for example, is not something to be dealt with lightly. If they are improperly installed or handled, serious problems can arise.

TPC: The popularity of multihulls has increased lately. Manufacturers and designers of these boats have also become more responsive to complaints about handling and comfort. Do you think they will eventually replace the standard mono-hull that has endured for so long? If so, do you see them as viable alternatives for the long distance blue-water cruiser?

Shaw: I must admit that I am a little surprised over the increase in interest in this kind of a boat. Certainly the catamarans have been around a long time, even the great Herreshoff designed a catamaran back in the 1800s, so multihull boats themselves are nothing new. But there is currently a clear and increasingly strong interest in this type of boat. The first thing I was concerned about is where do you put them because of their excessive beam. When I was talking to one of our past dealers here today, he said that in his particular instance, the catamaran he is marketing has a 15-foot beam which fits into the same slip as a Bertram 33 powerboat. That seems to answer the beam question very nicely. I must admit that I am a little surprised over the increase in interest in this kind of a boat. Certainly the catamarans have been around a long time, even the great Herreshoff designed a catamaran back in the 1800s, so multihull boats themselves are nothing new. But there is currently a clear and increasingly strong interest in this type of boat. The first thing I was concerned about is where do you put them because of their excessive beam. When I was talking to one of our past dealers here today, he said that in his particular instance, the catamaran he is marketing has a 15-foot beam which fits into the same slip as a Bertram 33 powerboat. That seems to answer the beam question very nicely.

I think perhaps the interest in the newer multihull designs stems from a trend where we see more and more evidence for the desire to go fast. In the case of mono-hulls, we are looking at boats today that get up to fourteen and fifteen knots which was unheard of years ago. The interest in things like wind surfers and high performance racing machines have all of a sudden come to the forefront. There is a certain element of interest out there on the part of the buyers to obtain a boat that can travel at much higher speeds. We used to think that six to seven knots was really going fast but this just may not turn on some of today’s buyers. How long will the trend last? I don’t think they are ever going to replace the monohull. I think there are still a lot of us out there that are dedicated to the traditional boat. The developments in traditional design and materials have certainly made great strides in terms of increasing their performance, while at the same time building in arrangements that recognize the market’s demand for safe, comfortable cruising.

TPC: Someone who knows the multihulls told me recently that they are fine boats and go faster than mono-hulls, but if you load them down with all the things we tend to put in our cruising homes, it really puts them off their design line. Then they don’t perform well and indeed, become very clunky.

Shaw: Well, that’s absolutely true, the same however, must be said of the mono-hull, I had an incident years ago where I designed a little boat that was very, very successful in its first two years of racing. At the beginning of the third year its performance began to really fall off. I walked on board to check it out and I thought at first that the boat was aground. I found out that the owner had continually added a lot of weight to the boat in the form of four gallons of alcohol when you only needed one, and lots of flash lights, spare batteries, tools, etc. The boat probably weighed 15 to 20 percent more than what she was designed to carry. You could actually feel the added displacement. As a result, she no longer was competitive. The boat was later sold and the new owner took all the extraneous stuff out, got her back on her lines and almost immediately, the boat came back to life again. This problem is certainly true and even probably more so for the multihull boats since they tend to be somewhat more sensitive to weight increases and redistribution.

TPC: I see what you mean. I’m sure that the toys and conveniences that I’ve added to my Pearson 35 over the years have impacted its performance.

Shaw: Well, undoubtedly, you have kind of a fixed amount of horsepower generated by the sail plan and as the boat increases its displacement obviously its resistance at a given speed increases in proportion to that displacement. Added weight can not help but have an effect on its performance. Well, undoubtedly, you have kind of a fixed amount of horsepower generated by the sail plan and as the boat increases its displacement obviously its resistance at a given speed increases in proportion to that displacement. Added weight can not help but have an effect on its performance.

TPC: Many sailors use their crafts as live-aboard homes and a means to get away for extended periods. One of the trade-offs a blue water sailor has to make is between the supposedly greater stability and tracking ability of the full keel design compared to the better speed of the relatively newer fin keel designs. Is this a real issue or have builders been able to give us both speed and stability through contemporary design and materials technology.

Shaw: I think they have. The first separated keel rudder combination that I designed was a little boat we built about twenty seven years ago called the Renegade. It was in the beginning of the era of the separated underbodies. Bill Lapworth led the field with this type of hull form with his Cal 40, Cat 28 etc. We and others found that the tracking ability of these split underbodies was really great. They were just as good in many ways as the traditional full keel boat. I think the most vivid example of the success of the split keel can be seen in the changes made in the boats competing in the various around-the-world races. It did not take long to make the shift from the full keel design to the split underbody. If anybody needs good tracking ability, these boats certainly did. So I believe that if the boat is properly designed with the right shape and balance in the rudder that nothing is lost with a split keel. I do however feel strongly that a skeg-rudder combination is the most forgiving of all of the split underbodies. They can, in my opinion, be equal to and potentially better performers than the full keels. I think they have. The first separated keel rudder combination that I designed was a little boat we built about twenty seven years ago called the Renegade. It was in the beginning of the era of the separated underbodies. Bill Lapworth led the field with this type of hull form with his Cal 40, Cat 28 etc. We and others found that the tracking ability of these split underbodies was really great. They were just as good in many ways as the traditional full keel boat. I think the most vivid example of the success of the split keel can be seen in the changes made in the boats competing in the various around-the-world races. It did not take long to make the shift from the full keel design to the split underbody. If anybody needs good tracking ability, these boats certainly did. So I believe that if the boat is properly designed with the right shape and balance in the rudder that nothing is lost with a split keel. I do however feel strongly that a skeg-rudder combination is the most forgiving of all of the split underbodies. They can, in my opinion, be equal to and potentially better performers than the full keels.

TPC: I think one of the things that happened with the split keel is they tend to have a flatter bottom so you tend to get more pounding and consequently they do not seem to cut through heavy seas like older boats that you designed. Is that part of the trade-off we have to live with?

Shaw: What you are looking at here is more in terms of the rating rules that influenced yacht design. The IOR rule had some depth measurements at the mid body, by making the hull flat in this area, the boat’s rating was lower than a similar hull with a "V" shaped cross section. You actually ended up with a U-shaped section that was very flat on the bottom. That U was carried well forward and did tend to increase the pounding. Now that we have gone to IMS, those kinds of measurements do not come into play at all. Boats are therefore, now returning to more normal underbody shapes that are better sea boats.

TPC: We have been through a tough economic recession that has dramatically hurt the boating industry. We seem to be coming out of it now and the economy is turning around a bit. But in the interim, we have seen a tremendous rise in the market share of the foreign builders. The French seem to have dominated, but other European builders have also cut into the American market. From your perspective, can we regain the lead in the industry? If so, do you see it happening in any specific area such as new, rebirth of boat building companies, racing, or technology?

Shaw: First of all, the effect of the foreign designs on the recreational sailboat market was more in evidence several years ago when the value of the franc was most attractive to the buyer with US dollars. That is not quite as much an issue today. We also found that foreign boats were designed to meet the requirements of their particular market which are certainly different to ours. I had my eyes opened years ago in Kiel, Germany one afternoon when some cruising boats were sailing out of their anchorage and marinas. All the boats had double reefed mains with entire crews on the rail in foul weather gear. My host, who was German, said to me that, "this was going to be a fine day for sailing." I asked him what it looks like on a bad day. First of all, the effect of the foreign designs on the recreational sailboat market was more in evidence several years ago when the value of the franc was most attractive to the buyer with US dollars. That is not quite as much an issue today. We also found that foreign boats were designed to meet the requirements of their particular market which are certainly different to ours. I had my eyes opened years ago in Kiel, Germany one afternoon when some cruising boats were sailing out of their anchorage and marinas. All the boats had double reefed mains with entire crews on the rail in foul weather gear. My host, who was German, said to me that, "this was going to be a fine day for sailing." I asked him what it looks like on a bad day.

This experience brought to mind an interesting observation we had when we entered the European market which we had done at one time. I was amazed while at the European boat shows and talking to people who were interested in the American boats. We would talk about the galley and particularly about the ice-box, things that were traditionally important to American consumers. The European sailor would look at me with a glassy stare questioning — what do we need an ice-box for? The truth is that Europeans tend to drink their liquor without any ice, and they don’t have the same cold storage demands as the American sailor. Furthermore, the temperature tends to be cold enough to keep anything they want sufficiently cool without allocating precious below deck space to refrigeration.

Basically it was the favorable value of the German mark vs. the US dollar and some very interesting contemporary designs that led to the rise in the European market share in the US. We did however, undergo several years of severely reduced growth that had more to with the luxury tax and the general economy of the United States than the influx of the foreign builder. I think now we are somewhat free from some of those things and hopefully the economy is really going to turn around sufficiently to bring the American builder back into his or her own again.

As far as our technology is concerned I don’t think we have to take second place to anybody in this world.

TPC: I am glad to hear you say that. This is a loaded question which I’m not sure you really want to get into, but do you think there is any hope that Pearson Yachts will resume production?

Shaw: I think I can address that. A comment often made to me from our dealers is that when Pearson left the market we served, we created a void that has yet to be filled. Walking around in this particular show today, I was disturbed to see that a Pearson quality boat at the price points that we represented, just does not seem to exist. We have on one hand very high performance boats, such as those being turned out by Carroll Marine, the J Boats and others. The extreme drafts relative to the length needed to balance these performance yachts are prohibitive, in terms of the cruising boat. I think I can address that. A comment often made to me from our dealers is that when Pearson left the market we served, we created a void that has yet to be filled. Walking around in this particular show today, I was disturbed to see that a Pearson quality boat at the price points that we represented, just does not seem to exist. We have on one hand very high performance boats, such as those being turned out by Carroll Marine, the J Boats and others. The extreme drafts relative to the length needed to balance these performance yachts are prohibitive, in terms of the cruising boat.